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Fed's Bullard: Coronavirus shutdown is not a recession but an investment in survival – CNBC

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A view of the empty street at 54th street and 6th Ave in Midtown Manhattan in the wake of the coronavirus outbreak on March 20, 2020 in New York City.

Roy Rochlin | Getty Images

In normal times massive unemployment and a collapse in economic output would be tragic.

This time, as the coronavirus cloisters millions of Americans and shuts down the U.S. economy, it should instead be saluted as an investment in public health that lays the groundwork for a rapid rebound.

That is the view of St. Louis Federal Reserve President James Bullard, who argues that a potential $2.5 trillion hit coming to the economy is both necessary and manageable if officials move fast and keep it simple. It may seem an unconventional view in a moment of global anxiety, but Bullard argues the shutdown measures now being rolled out are essential to shortening the course of the pandemic.

They must also be coupled with massive federal government support to sustain the population through its coming isolation and prime the economy to pick up where it left off.

To Bullard that means:

Match any lost wages.

Match any lost business.

No questions asked.

No arguments about bailouts or “moral hazard” – the sticky issue of publicly funded rescues of bad actors.

And, above all, when the losses are tallied, don’t call it a recession.

Recessions are the ordinary – even predictable – contractions in activity that mark the end of normal business cycles. Bullard, who has earned a reputation inside the Fed for a penchant to rethink problems and reframe debates, said this is anything but.

“Frame this as a massive investment in U.S. public health,” Bullard said in a Friday telephone interview.

“Crazy heavy jobless claims?” That’s ok

Bullard’s comments came as U.S. lawmakers debated emergency economic measures worth $1 trillion or more, a figure Bullard says may underestimate what’s needed.

Nonetheless it is still opening old wounds from the 2007-2009 economic crisis over who deserves what, whether corporations should get help, and how generous the government should be with workers.

The spread of the coronavirus has touched off those discussions worldwide, but with an urgency that is shredding old hesitancies. United Kingdom Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s government on Friday announced it would pick up 80% of the national wage bill for the next three months.

Many Fed officials have called for a stronger U.S. fiscal response in recent days, but Bullard went a step further with an explicit call for the U.S. government to match what is being lost dollar for dollar.

For now, he said, economists and policymakers should turn their view of data on its head because little will make sense otherwise.

The recent jump in unemployment claims? That’s a win, a sign that so-called government stabilizers are being used. The hope should be that such programs get “crazy heavy use” in coming weeks, he said.

If economic output falls by half in the second quarter, that’s a win — not a record-setting defeat. It means businesses have heeded orders to close and customers to stay home.

“We are not trying to move production and income up in the second quarter. We are trying to keep it out of the second quarter,” Bullard said.

“You want capital to just sit in place. Switch off the factory … Then switch it back on.”

30% unemployment a possibility

Bullard was among the large group at the Fed who at first felt the virus risk would pass with little economic damage, as have other similar health scares such as SARS and ebola.

They are all now trying to catch up, with emergency rate cuts, extensive new programs to keep markets working, and other steps to aid an economy grinding to a halt.

In line with his colleagues, he said he was ready to do more, including putting more of the Fed’s direct lending powers to work if needed.

“It is early days and we are willing to do more. I am willing to do more,” he said.

Bullard was blunt about the dilemma posed, saying the economics profession was “reeling” as it tries to understand what is taking place.

For now what’s usually good — jobs and production — are bad, and the headline numbers are going to be staggering.

Bullard’s ballpark estimate is that unemployment could hit 30%, higher than in the Great Depression and three times more than the 2007-2009 recession.

Output in the second quarter could be half the norm, a hit of about $2.5 trillion.

That is unavoidable if the virus is to be contained through “social distancing” or government orders to stay at home.

Keep everyone whole

All this needn’t wreck the economy. Legislation working its way through Congress has begun to roll out some support.

Bullard said the “core aim” can be kept simple: “keep everyone, households and businesses whole through the second quarter.” Do it with a quick expansion of unemployment insurance to cover lost wages, and through grants and loans to business to cover losses from “unemployed” capital.

From a macroeconomic standpoint, he argues, it is a tractable problem. Again using back of the envelope math and a 30,000-foot view, he said perhaps half a trillion dollars of lost output will be accounted for by necessarily lost consumption – all the movie tickets and clothes no one buys and trips people will not take.

As to the other $2 trillion, Bullard said the federal government should borrow and distribute it to people and business.

“That is completely feasible,” in service of limiting economic damage, he said. “This is a planned, organized partial shut down of the U.S. economy. We are throttling back output on purpose to meet health guidelines… Transfer income to affected households.”

“Call it pandemic relief,” Bullard said. “Get transfers to businesses that are affected heavily, and come out on the other side. Identical economy. Produce the same goods as before.”

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S&P/TSX gains almost 100 points, U.S. markets also higher ahead of rate decision

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TORONTO – Strength in the base metal and technology sectors helped Canada’s main stock index gain almost 100 points on Friday, while U.S. stock markets climbed to their best week of the year.

“It’s been almost a complete opposite or retracement of what we saw last week,” said Philip Petursson, chief investment strategist at IG Wealth Management.

In New York, the Dow Jones industrial average was up 297.01 points at 41,393.78. The S&P 500 index was up 30.26 points at 5,626.02, while the Nasdaq composite was up 114.30 points at 17,683.98.

The S&P/TSX composite index closed up 93.51 points at 23,568.65.

While last week saw a “healthy” pullback on weaker economic data, this week investors appeared to be buying the dip and hoping the central bank “comes to the rescue,” said Petursson.

Next week, the U.S. Federal Reserve is widely expected to cut its key interest rate for the first time in several years after it significantly hiked it to fight inflation.

But the magnitude of that first cut has been the subject of debate, and the market appears split on whether the cut will be a quarter of a percentage point or a larger half-point reduction.

Petursson thinks it’s clear the smaller cut is coming. Economic data recently hasn’t been great, but it hasn’t been that bad either, he said — and inflation may have come down significantly, but it’s not defeated just yet.

“I think they’re going to be very steady,” he said, with one small cut at each of their three decisions scheduled for the rest of 2024, and more into 2025.

“I don’t think there’s a sense of urgency on the part of the Fed that they have to do something immediately.

A larger cut could also send the wrong message to the markets, added Petursson: that the Fed made a mistake in waiting this long to cut, or that it’s seeing concerning signs in the economy.

It would also be “counter to what they’ve signaled,” he said.

More important than the cut — other than the new tone it sets — will be what Fed chair Jerome Powell has to say, according to Petursson.

“That’s going to be more important than the size of the cut itself,” he said.

In Canada, where the central bank has already cut three times, Petursson expects two more before the year is through.

“Here, the labour situation is worse than what we see in the United States,” he said.

The Canadian dollar traded for 73.61 cents US compared with 73.58 cents US on Thursday.

The October crude oil contract was down 32 cents at US$68.65 per barrel and the October natural gas contract was down five cents at US$2.31 per mmBTU.

The December gold contract was up US$30.10 at US$2,610.70 an ounce and the December copper contract was up four cents US$4.24 a pound.

— With files from The Associated Press

This report by The Canadian Press was first published Sept. 13, 2024.

Companies in this story: (TSX:GSPTSE, TSX:CADUSD)

The Canadian Press. All rights reserved.

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S&P/TSX composite down more than 200 points, U.S. stock markets also fall

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TORONTO – Canada’s main stock index was down more than 200 points in late-morning trading, weighed down by losses in the technology, base metal and energy sectors, while U.S. stock markets also fell.

The S&P/TSX composite index was down 239.24 points at 22,749.04.

In New York, the Dow Jones industrial average was down 312.36 points at 40,443.39. The S&P 500 index was down 80.94 points at 5,422.47, while the Nasdaq composite was down 380.17 points at 16,747.49.

The Canadian dollar traded for 73.80 cents US compared with 74.00 cents US on Thursday.

The October crude oil contract was down US$1.07 at US$68.08 per barrel and the October natural gas contract was up less than a penny at US$2.26 per mmBTU.

The December gold contract was down US$2.10 at US$2,541.00 an ounce and the December copper contract was down four cents at US$4.10 a pound.

This report by The Canadian Press was first published Sept. 6, 2024.

Companies in this story: (TSX:GSPTSE, TSX:CADUSD)

The Canadian Press. All rights reserved.

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S&P/TSX composite up more than 150 points, U.S. stock markets also higher

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TORONTO – Canada’s main stock index was up more than 150 points in late-morning trading, helped by strength in technology, financial and energy stocks, while U.S. stock markets also pushed higher.

The S&P/TSX composite index was up 171.41 points at 23,298.39.

In New York, the Dow Jones industrial average was up 278.37 points at 41,369.79. The S&P 500 index was up 38.17 points at 5,630.35, while the Nasdaq composite was up 177.15 points at 17,733.18.

The Canadian dollar traded for 74.19 cents US compared with 74.23 cents US on Wednesday.

The October crude oil contract was up US$1.75 at US$76.27 per barrel and the October natural gas contract was up less than a penny at US$2.10 per mmBTU.

The December gold contract was up US$18.70 at US$2,556.50 an ounce and the December copper contract was down less than a penny at US$4.22 a pound.

This report by The Canadian Press was first published Aug. 29, 2024.

Companies in this story: (TSX:GSPTSE, TSX:CADUSD)

The Canadian Press. All rights reserved.

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